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Regarding the thread:
After the question in that thread of whether the logic of 'materials not being a barrier' extended to include several hundred feet of solid stone, some of the responders did indicate that it was a valid concern and that the use of some range limitation based on materials was a reasonable measure. I did not vote in the poll, but would have indicated 'partially' as well.


My position:
The interpretation of the use of the word 'target' is not without some consideration, but by your own proposed comparison for magical parallels that do not 'target' things and only scan both Detect Magic and Detect Undead do express the limitation.

The point about Contact not being blocked does adhere to the exceptions from the "Line of Sight" description for both the first sentence [Unless the description states otherwise (the Contact power explicitly states otherwise)] and the last sentence ["...powers which list modifiers for targets which are outside of the psionicists field of vision"]. So this is clearly an intended exception.

Unmitigated detection out to a sphere of 300 ft radius through all materials (including solid rock, metal, etc) not only seems quite a stretch to me (especially given the rank of the ability and the psp expenditure), but would necessitate calculating every living thing on all levels of the dungeon above and below within that range. And, I would expect, create quite a mess of information coming in to the character.

I am not looking to completely hobble or hinder a character's ability, but to me it seems to be an oversight where similar considerations exist with similar abilities. As I mentioned before, the pure 'line of sight' explanation also does not seem to meet the intended use of the ability. This is leading to my interpretation that it can penetrate solid objects, just not without some degree of interference.



So I am going to propose the following in good-faith in hopes of an agreement:
Materials do interfere with the range of the power Life Detection in a similar manner to scanning detection magics (such as Detect Magic, Detect undead, etc) at a degree of 1 plus an order of magnitude. Thus an accumulated 11 Yards of wood, 11 Feet of stone or 11 inches of metal would be the limit.

Therefore successful use of the ability would detect creatures in an empty space beyond: several wooden walls/ doors/ trees, an 11 ft thick section of wall (a little meta I admit but to accommodate the intent since standard dungeon spacing is 10 feet), or nearly 1 foot of metal. It would sense anything in an empty space beyond a lesser thickness of said materials. So, for example, If Stephen scanned through a 10 ft thick section of wall, he would detect everything in the empty room beyond until he met the opposite wall if it were 1 ft thick or more

Is being able to detect all thinking life within 300 feet going to break this module wide open, such that it needs to be nerfed?

And this is probably going to come across as passive-aggressive, but are there any other of Stephen's powers you'd like to nerf before we continue?

Lord Torath wrote: ↑Tue Sep 16, 2025 6:36 pm Is being able to detect all thinking life within 300 feet going to break this module wide open, such that it needs to be nerfed?

And this is probably going to come across as passive-aggressive, but are there any other of Stephen's powers you'd like to nerf before we continue?

I gave you my rationale, and you know I have put a lot of thought into this decision. While you may see it as a 'nerf', it is not intended as such since the only strict guidance I could find that I believe applies was more restrictive (line of sight). In the same way the nearest parallell (material interference for other scanning detection style powers) was more restrictive than the adjudication.

And I agree, your comment did come off as passive aggressive.

TristenC wrote: ↑Wed Sep 17, 2025 6:18 amI gave you my rationale, and you know I have put a lot of thought into this decision. While you may see it as a 'nerf', it is not intended as such since the only strict guidance I could find that I believe applies was more restrictive (line of sight).

This is only true if you think that Life Detection targets the creatures it detects. But it does nothing to them. It does not apply any condition or penalty (or bonus!) to them. Life Detection literally does nothing to anyone other than the initiating psionicist. To the psionicist, it alters their perceptions to be able to detect thinking beings with a defined area of effect.

Can you tell me what effect it puts on those it detects?

I disagree with your interpretation that the word 'target' only applys to creatures affected by a power, and again refer to your own recommendations about looking at detect magic and detect undead. Those same conditions (the lack of bonus, condition or penalty) are true, and for those abilities the material thickness is clearly listed as a consideration.

We have both stated our stance on this several times and it feels like we are going in circles.

Here’s another thing to consider:
Contact goes through walls with a -1 penalty to the power score (Wisdom + nothin’) for a final score of Wis -1

Life Detection is rather similar to Contact, in that it doesn’t do anything to the target. Assuming it also goes through walls, one could expect a similar -1 penalty to the power score.

It’s power score is Intelligence-2. Intelligence is already likely to be lower than Wisdom for your average psionicist (this is true for Stephen), since it’s not a Prime Requisite. And it’s got a -2 modifier which is double the penalty for Contact going through walls.

Does it seem possible the designers already took into account the difficulty of scanning through solid materials?