Page 1 of 1
Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:33 pm
by garhkal
Over on DF we are discussing whether a gaze attack (such as a vampire's charm or medusae's petrification) works through a wall of force. Some say since light does pass through, and merely meeting the medusae's gaze is what causes the petrification, unlike say a catoplebas's death RAY, it should work. Others disagree, saying the wall of force blocks everything passing through. Though some feel all BUT illusions get blockd.
What do you all say on this subject?
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:57 pm
by Cole
No, it's everything. It's refractive. Medusa can suck it. No rays either, only light because it's just light, but it's refracting through it. So I say it blocks everything. Of course teleport or dimension door can circumvent it. Some spells can dispel it like disintegrate, or disjunction etc.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:34 pm
by Halaster-Blackcloak
A wall of force spell creates an invisible barrier in the locale desired by the caster, up to the spell's range. The wall of force cannot move and is totally unaffected by most spells, including dispel magic. However, a disintegrate spell will immediately destroy it, as will a rod of cancellation or a sphere of annihilation. Likewise, the wall of force is not affected by blows, missiles, cold, heat, electricity, etc. Spells and breath weapons cannot pass through it in either direction, although dimension door, teleport, and similar effects can bypass the barrier.
All emphasis mine. The barrier is invisible. Therefore, gaze attacks (which work by sight) should work, especially since (for example) a medusa's gaze attack works into the Astral and Ethereal. Note that the glossary says of gaze attacks:
"Gaze attack - the ability of a creature, such as a basilisk, to attack simply by making eye contact with the victim."
The medusa (for example)
can make eye contact because the barrier is invisible. So therefore she can attack through the barrier. It's not a spell or a physical effect (such as dragon's breath) and it can reach through to other dimensions.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:54 pm
by garhkal
Cole wrote:No, it's everything. It's refractive. Medusa can suck it. No rays either, only light because it's just light, but it's refracting through it. So I say it blocks everything. Of course teleport or dimension door can circumvent it. Some spells can dispel it like disintegrate, or disjunction etc.
That's where i see a disconnect. If teleport or dimension door, can 'bypass it, cause they skip into the astral/ethreal planes to go around, why wouldn't a medusae's gaze which also skips into the etheral, bypass it? And if light passes through, then someone can easily meet the gaze of an umber hulk, and thus to ME should now need to save vs its confusion.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:12 pm
by JadedDM
I'd agree gaze attacks would work through it. The
SRD confirms this:
"Gaze attacks can operate through a wall of force."
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:54 pm
by Halaster-Blackcloak
This to me seems common sense in that if you can see a medusa, it can affect you. But I have similar problems with anti-magic shell hedging out breath weapons. Breath weapons are not magical, otherwise creatures with magic resistance would be able to resist dragon breath. So anti-magic shell should not be able to repel dragon breath. Likewise, a wizard would be able to dispel dragon breath as it attacks. Neither is true. Same for gaze attacks.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:55 pm
by garhkal
Halaster-Blackcloak wrote:This to me seems common sense in that if you can see a medusa, it can affect you. But I have similar problems with anti-magic shell hedging out breath weapons. Breath weapons are not magical, otherwise creatures with magic resistance would be able to resist dragon breath. So anti-magic shell should not be able to repel dragon breath. Likewise, a wizard would be able to dispel dragon breath as it attacks. Neither is true. Same for gaze attacks.
Same here. I hated the whole "AMS Blocks anything not a mundane attack" bull that both 1e and 2e had..
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:02 pm
by Cole
I simply thought a wall of force was a liquid like entity, not an invisible wall. If there is nothing physically there and you can see straight through it, then I don't see why a medusa's eyes wouldn't work. A balisk would to then and a ton of other things .... at least if we are talking 3E.
What edition are you wanting opinions for Gar?
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:25 pm
by garhkal
It was posted on DF in the 1e forum, but 2e is also viable.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:53 am
by Cole
Well, I'm going to look that up, because I don't recall it being a purely transparent wall. I thought it was described as a shimmering wall and thus would refract light and distort a gaze attack. I'll be back.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:12 am
by Cole
Ok, in 1E it is clearly described as "an invisible wall" and to me, that's good enough to prove a medusa or a balisk etc can use it's gaze attacks right through it as they are NOT spells, they are special abilities.
Not sure what spell I was thinking of off the top of my head that shimmers and refracts light, but it wasn't "Wall of Force".
I speaking now from a 1E standpoint. I'm sure 2E is exactly the same.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:12 pm
by RPG Dinosaur
Is there anybody who believes that a W. of Force prevents psionics from passing? I personally do not.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:33 am
by Halaster-Blackcloak
I'd say no as well.
Re: Walls of force. What goes through?
Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:55 am
by garhkal
Me neither.